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KittyHisses
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quote:
Originally posted by Manitoba Legend


If nothing else, Dailene must have learned a ton about mental toughness from Team Kelly Scott. Kelley Law no longer has the shots to produce a BC champion unless Scott & Shredder leave the scene.

If JJ bolts for Ontario (which I doubt with an Olympic berth only 7 teams away) then maybe Kaitlyn Lawes brings Dailene aboard at third but I really don't know if Askin and Officer would stay in place for Baby Kates and Dailene.

Plus, Baby has the tag of being a total choke when the big games arrive and she doesn't (ie. junior worlds, 2 scotts with JJ)



She didnt choke at the Juniors Worlds she was at. She lost to Eve Muirhead twice who is superior. In her last attempt she had an extremely difficult shot she was unlikely to make the try and win the game. That is not choking.

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Old Post 04-06-12 08:11PM
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KittyHisses
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quote:
Originally posted by Unregistered

Your as bad if not worse with Kelly Scott then a certain someone here is with JJ



It is not my fault if you did not watch Kelly Scott at her peak in 2006-2007 play. If you did you would realize how nearly unplayable she was then. She was far and away better than Jennifer Jones who this forum thinks is a curling god. She and her team (well 3/4s of her former team) are getting back to that form again and if they do they will again be the team to beat, just as they were then. Dont like it, tough, it is reality.

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Old Post 04-06-12 08:14PM
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Manitoba Legend
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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


It is not my fault if you did not watch Kelly Scott at her peak in 2006-2007 play. If you did you would realize how nearly unplayable she was then. She was far and away better than Jennifer Jones who this forum thinks is a curling god. She and her team (well 3/4s of her former team) are getting back to that form again and if they do they will again be the team to beat, just as they were then. Dont like it, tough, it is reality.



I agree that Jeanna Schraeder in her prime is a far better third than either Cathy O or JJ's current 3rd K. Lawes.

I submit that Sasha Carter impressed me greatly for both her will to win under pressure at this year's Scotts (she wsa pregnant, sick and playing third instead of her normal 2nd spot) and she played great.

Askin is still superior to anything Kelly Scott can recruit in BC.

However, when it comes to the skip position. Kelly is not quite in the same league as Jen. Jen is simply able to make a far wider range of shots - she also can play all the weight classes while Scott is limited from guard weight to light hack.

Scott is a far more defensive curler, very careful while JJ can get reckless on her 'Take no Hostages' strategy. Scotts games are boring and repetitive, while a typical Jones game is spell-binding.

One area, often over-looked is coaching. On that one there's no comparison. Gerry Richard is a professional coach while Janet Arnott is simply a friend, a professional agreer and an equipment girl. Big edge to Team Scott on that one.

Jones plays a far more extensive and professional schedule, allowing more intake of CTRS points while Scott is far more regional. Hopefully, Scott is going to take her last stand with Jeanna & Sash and will play far more leading to the trials, Scotts, Worlds and Olympics.

When Scott is at her best and has a third who is clutch from End 1 thru 10, she'll torment almost all comers. Too strong at third and second for the next 2 or 3 best canadian womens rinks.

Jones third tend to collapse in late end crunch-time. (PROVEN) while Officer used to dominate Carter by a slight edge - now I'd rate them equallly, possibly the odd edge to Carter.

On paper Jones is still Canada's #1

Scott is probably #2
Nedohin is obviously #3
The Wild Things (Homan) #4
Lawton #5
Middaugh #6
Larouche #7
Carey #8
Kleibrink #9
Cathy O or Webster #10

There's a passel of Alberta teams knockin' on the door - including Scheidigger, Sweeting, couple others. I wouldn't put Law or McCarville in the top 10 right now.

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Old Post 04-06-12 08:40PM
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Tap Back
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quote:
[i]Originally posted by Manitoba Legend

Plus, Baby has the tag of being a total choke when the big games arrive and she doesn't (ie. junior worlds, 2 scotts with JJ) [/B]


Sorry Mr NOITALL but the only mention of "choke" I have seen mentioned comes from you. That is a cruel and unwarranted tag you and only you have repeatedly...I mean repeatedly spewed way too many times to mention.

You are truly a piece of work and have not ever been a competitor at any level of consequence is my firm belief. If you were you would not unfairly tag Kaitlyn this way.

I have a lot of money to bet that you do not have the cajones to say that to her face under any circumstance.

P.S. I would say that to your face in a New York Minute just so you know where I am coming from.

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Old Post 04-06-12 09:00PM
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Unregistered
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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


It is not my fault if you did not watch Kelly Scott at her peak in 2006-2007 play. If you did you would realize how nearly unplayable she was then. She was far and away better than Jennifer Jones who this forum thinks is a curling god. She and her team (well 3/4s of her former team) are getting back to that form again and if they do they will again be the team to beat, just as they were then. Dont like it, tough, it is reality.



The reality is that times have changed. In 2006/2007 who was around to really challenge her? Colleen was done and Jenniffer had noy yet reached her form she has now.

If she was as un playable as you say she was in 2006 she would have won that world championship instead she got bronze

The womens game is much more competitive now. Thtas not to say they couldn't be a top team but you are jumping the gun with some of your statements in saying that she is the team to beat in the 2013 trials and tha 2014 olympics

and by the way i did watch her during that time

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Old Post 04-06-12 09:01PM
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KittyHisses
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quote:
Originally posted by Unregistered


The reality is that times have changed. In 2006/2007 who was around to really challenge her? Colleen was done and Jenniffer had noy yet reached her form she has now.

If she was as un playable as you say she was in 2006 she would have won that world championship instead she got bronze

The womens game is much more competitive now. Thtas not to say they couldn't be a top team but you are jumping the gun with some of your statements in saying that she is the team to beat in the 2013 trials and tha 2014 olympics

and by the way i did watch her during that time



The 2006 Worlds was won by Anette Norberg, one of the greatest womens teams of all time. No Canadian team, not even the best one, will win Worlds every year in the Norberg era (maybe a prime Sandra Schirmler brought back from the grave, but that is it). Atleast Kelly Scott at her best was able to challenge Anette Norberg which the other top Canadian womens teams including Jennifer Jones have shown unable to do whatsoever. Kelly Scott was roughly Norberg's equal those 2 years, which already puts her far above all other Canadian teams since Colleen Jones.

At the 2006 and 2007 Scott, Kelly Scott convincingly outplayed Jennifer Jones, Colleen Jones, and Jan Betker. You say those teams werent any good then. This is not at all true, Jennifer Jones won the 2005 Scotties, and was beaten only by Scott in the finals or semis of the 2006 and 2007 Scotties, and led the money tour 2 of those 3 years I believe. It is more like the only difference in her run of Scotties titles was she no longer faced the Kelly Scott team at her peak which opened the door for her to become top Canadian team. As for Colleen she was playing Kelly Scott in the 1-2 game of the 2006 Scotties, which would already dismiss the idea she was no longer a force.

You are saying the field is stronger now, LOL! How exactly. Who are these new superpowers that emerged. I see all the same teams in the final rounds of the Scotties, other than Heather Nedohin but that is only since she was kept out of the event by the likes of Kleibrink and Bernard for years. Maybe on the World level there are a couple new powers. If you want to say the Canadian women were weak when Scott was dominant, fine I concur, but they are still weak now as their continued streak of almost never winning at the World level proves, so she need not worry about that.

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Old Post 04-06-12 09:24PM
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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


The 2006 Worlds was won by Anette Norberg, one of the greatest womens teams of all time. No Canadian team, not even the best one, will win Worlds every year in the Norberg era (maybe a prime Sandra Schirmler brought back from the grave, but that is it). Atleast Kelly Scott at her best was able to challenge Anette Norberg which the other top Canadian womens teams including Jennifer Jones have shown unable to do whatsoever. Kelly Scott was roughly Norberg's equal those 2 years, which already puts her far above all other Canadian teams since Colleen Jones.

At the 2006 and 2007 Scott, Kelly Scott convincingly outplayed Jennifer Jones, Colleen Jones, and Jan Betker. You say those teams werent any good then. This is not at all true, Jennifer Jones won the 2005 Scotties, and was beaten only by Scott in the finals or semis of the 2006 and 2007 Scotties, and led the money tour 2 of those 3 years I believe. It is more like the only difference in her run of Scotties titles was she no longer faced the Kelly Scott team at her peak which opened the door for her to become top Canadian team. As for Colleen she was playing Kelly Scott in the 1-2 game of the 2006 Scotties, which would already dismiss the idea she was no longer a force.

You are saying the field is stronger now, LOL! How exactly. Who are these new superpowers that emerged. I see all the same teams in the final rounds of the Scotties, other than Heather Nedohin but that is only since she was kept out of the event by the likes of Kleibrink and Bernard for years. Maybe on the World level there are a couple new powers. If you want to say the Canadian women were weak when Scott was dominant, fine I concur, but they are still weak now as their continued streak of almost never winning at the World level proves, so she need not worry about that.



lol your going to say that kelly scott was anette norberg's equal? thats an incredibly stupid statement. what exactly did she do in 2006 to put her at equal? Anette disposed of kelly easily in 2006. Yes kelly beat her in 2007 but I think we can both agree that Anette was not herself at those 2007 worlds

I never said Jenniffer wasnt good but she definately was not at the level she is now.Colleen was in the downswing of her career. 2006 was her final year, if she was still a force she would have continued to rep nova scotia

I also never said there were super powre s coming up my statement was that when kelly won her 2 national titles the 2 biggest threats were jenniffer jones and colleen jones and i have already stated why they werent as serious a threat as jenniffer would grow to be and colleen had been. Now at the scotties the fields are stronger than they were in 2006/2007 with teams like holland, nedohin, kleibrink, bernard, mccarville,lawton, horgan and larouche.

the fact that canada has now gone without gold on the womens field for so long now doesnt prove weakness in canada's part so much as growth in the world teams.

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Old Post 04-06-12 10:13PM
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Nine Ender
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For next season, my early pick to win Scotties would be #1 R. Homan and then #2 J. Jones. Of course, both have competition to qualify which makes predictions tricky.

K. Scott has the advantage of having a somewhat easier path to nationals. I have confidance in Kelly herself, but it remains to be seen if Schraeder can regain top form and adapt to a more aggressive game plan. People might have forgotten at her last Scotties she had a bad week ( for whatever reason who knows ).

So I put Scott in with around 10 teams that could contend but everything has to break their way. For example, Homan losing Ontario this year was a break for Nedohin. Anybody winning Alberta could win, Chelsey Carey could win, some dream team out of Saskatchewan could win.

The idea that Scott is somehow head and shoulders above these teams is ridiculous.

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Old Post 04-07-12 12:49AM
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Manitoba Legend
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quote:
Originally posted by Nine Ender
For next season, my early pick to win Scotties would be #1 R. Homan and then #2 J. Jones. Of course, both have competition to qualify which makes predictions tricky.

K. Scott has the advantage of having a somewhat easier path to nationals. I have confidance in Kelly herself, but it remains to be seen if Schraeder can regain top form and adapt to a more aggressive game plan. People might have forgotten at her last Scotties she had a bad week ( for whatever reason who knows ).

So I put Scott in with around 10 teams that could contend but everything has to break their way. For example, Homan losing Ontario this year was a break for Nedohin. Anybody winning Alberta could win, Chelsey Carey could win, some dream team out of Saskatchewan could win.

The idea that Scott is somehow head and shoulders above these teams is ridiculous.



Even with an average lead (I'm sure Kelly will find an above average lead) Scott will terrorize the BC ladies curling scene - AGAIN!

Especially if Jeanna Schraeder returns to form and resumes tormenting all comers at third.

The Scotties are important but next year all focus will be on the Olympic qualifiers in Winnipeg. The better teams might gear their entire season to Olympic qualification, meaning the Scotts and certain cash events take a back seat. I would think this applies to Jones for sure (since she's already qualified) but probably applies to Scott, Lawton, Homan and one or two others. It can't apply to Heather Nedohin as she's "burdened" by her auto-berth in the Scotts (as the defender)....

From a Scotties point of view, this is good news for teams like Tracy Horgan, Jenn Hanna, Kelley Law, Marla Mallett, Sherry Middaugh, Chelsea Carey, Cathy Overton as their primary tormentors might not be gearing or peaking at the time their provincial Scotts are set.

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Old Post 04-07-12 08:24AM
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KittyHisses
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quote:
Originally posted by Unregistered


lol your going to say that kelly scott was anette norberg's equal? thats an incredibly stupid statement. what exactly did she do in 2006 to put her at equal? Anette disposed of kelly easily in 2006. Yes kelly beat her in 2007 but I think we can both agree that Anette was not herself at those 2007 worlds

I never said Jenniffer wasnt good but she definately was not at the level she is now.Colleen was in the downswing of her career. 2006 was her final year, if she was still a force she would have continued to rep nova scotia

I also never said there were super powre s coming up my statement was that when kelly won her 2 national titles the 2 biggest threats were jenniffer jones and colleen jones and i have already stated why they werent as serious a threat as jenniffer would grow to be and colleen had been. Now at the scotties the fields are stronger than they were in 2006/2007 with teams like holland, nedohin, kleibrink, bernard, mccarville,lawton, horgan and larouche.

the fact that canada has now gone without gold on the womens field for so long now doesnt prove weakness in canada's part so much as growth in the world teams.



The Scotties field is not stronger now. To suggest so is ridiculous. The 2010 and 2011 Scotties were two of the worst in history. The teams you mentioned were all very much active in 2006 and 2007. Kleibrink, Lawton, Larouche, and Bernard were much bigger forces from 2006-2009 than what they are today. So on what planet were those teams competition now and not then. Holland has improved although with the suck Schneider sisters it is a miracle she ever won something. Nobody is trembling at McCarville or Horgan at this point, or at any point thus far. How many times have those two teams even qualified for the Scotties. Sherry Middaugh and Sherry Anderson were atleast still threats back then, more formidable foes than McCarville or Horgan with any of their teams thus far.

Canadian womens curling is weaker than ever right now. Certainly atleast as weak as what you think it was in 2006-2007. That is pretty much an unanimous consensus of nearly everyone. I never said it was particularly strong in 2006-2007 for historical standards, but it certainly hasnt improved since then.

It also should be much easier to win at the World level than a few years ago. Norberg is old and past her best (yes she won Worlds last year, this despite having a new developing team, and not being of her former caliber). The Chinese have fallen well off. The Americans are no longer sending very competitive teams for whatever reason. Canadian women still arent managing it.

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Old Post 04-07-12 05:46PM
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KittyHisses
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I look forward to the haters reaction in 2013 when Queens Kelly Scott/Schraeder/Carter returns to their rightful place atop womens curling. At their best there was nobody better and this will be proven again next year.

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decade
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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


The Scotties field is not stronger now. To suggest so is ridiculous. The 2010 and 2011 Scotties were two of the worst in history. t.



Boy, what a slam against those teams. Can't wait until KH makes her appearance at the Scotties.

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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


The Scotties field is not stronger now. To suggest so is ridiculous. The 2010 and 2011 Scotties were two of the worst in history. The teams you mentioned were all very much active in 2006 and 2007. Kleibrink, Lawton, Larouche, and Bernard were much bigger forces from 2006-2009 than what they are today. So on what planet were those teams competition now and not then. Holland has improved although with the suck Schneider sisters it is a miracle she ever won something. Nobody is trembling at McCarville or Horgan at this point, or at any point thus far. How many times have those two teams even qualified for the Scotties. Sherry Middaugh and Sherry Anderson were atleast still threats back then, more formidable foes than McCarville or Horgan with any of their teams thus far.

Canadian womens curling is weaker than ever right now. Certainly atleast as weak as what you think it was in 2006-2007. That is pretty much an unanimous consensus of nearly everyone. I never said it was particularly strong in 2006-2007 for historical standards, but it certainly hasnt improved since then.

It also should be much easier to win at the World level than a few years ago. Norberg is old and past her best (yes she won Worlds last year, this despite having a new developing team, and not being of her former caliber). The Chinese have fallen well off. The Americans are no longer sending very competitive teams for whatever reason. Canadian women still arent managing it.



why should it be easier to win at worlds now? Yes norberg has fallen off but sweden is a proven breeding ground for amazing teams in the womens game. There just always seems to be some team ready to step up when the current dominating team goes into decline or leave the game. Scotland has an abundance of strong young curlers coming up , namely eve muirhead. Lene nielsen is inconsistent but still a big obstacle. Switzerland has mirjam ott and strong teams on the rise. Korea is getting better all the time. Andrea schopp may not be what she was but she still wont roll over for canadian teams. If anything the worlds is only getting harder for the women to win

We can sit here and argue about the strength of the scotties field all you want but its clear we'll never agree

I just think you need to step back and scale down the kelly scott fanaticism. She has the game to be at the top but , contrary to what you think just because she has jeanna back it doesnt mean she will stroll to the win at the olympic trials/olympics or a scotties title next year. She certianly will not be the favorite

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Old Post 04-07-12 07:02PM
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Nine Ender
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quote:
Originally posted by KittyHisses


The Scotties field is not stronger now. To suggest so is ridiculous. The 2010 and 2011 Scotties were two of the worst in history. The teams you mentioned were all very much active in 2006 and 2007. Kleibrink, Lawton, Larouche, and Bernard were much bigger forces from 2006-2009 than what they are today. So on what planet were those teams competition now and not then. Holland has improved although with the suck Schneider sisters it is a miracle she ever won something. Nobody is trembling at McCarville or Horgan at this point, or at any point thus far. How many times have those two teams even qualified for the Scotties. Sherry Middaugh and Sherry Anderson were atleast still threats back then, more formidable foes than McCarville or Horgan with any of their teams thus far.

Canadian womens curling is weaker than ever right now. Certainly atleast as weak as what you think it was in 2006-2007. That is pretty much an unanimous consensus of nearly everyone. I never said it was particularly strong in 2006-2007 for historical standards, but it certainly hasnt improved since then.

It also should be much easier to win at the World level than a few years ago. Norberg is old and past her best (yes she won Worlds last year, this despite having a new developing team, and not being of her former caliber). The Chinese have fallen well off. The Americans are no longer sending very competitive teams for whatever reason. Canadian women still arent managing it.



McCarville went to Scotties several times; the reason nobodies trembling about them is she revamped her team with a new third. However, McCarville with her old team achieved as much as Middaugh ever did at the Scotties. She's one of best clutch players in the game, but she needs the team to match.

I happen to agree with you this was a fairly weak year at Scotties. Too many temporary/revamped lineups, maternity leaves, and Homan missed qualifying. Olympics cycle is a big part of this.

I believe it will be much stronger next season. You repeatably ignore Homan, who is basically Canada's Eve Muirhead. 12-0 in the Ontario playdowns then lost the sudden death final.

I'm no hater, I was impressed with Scott at this year's event. She played a more aggressive style, carried her team at times.

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